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Does cross-entropy cost make sense in the context of regression? (as opposed to classification) If so, could you give a toy example through tensorflow and if not, why not?

I was reading about cross entropy in Neural Networks and Deep Learning by Michael Nielsen and it seems like something that could naturally be used for regression as well as classification, but I don't understand how you'd apply it efficiently in tensorflow since the loss functions take logits (which I don't really understand either) and they're listed under Classification here

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    $\begingroup$ I found here on quora that states different from what is accepted as an answer for this question $\endgroup$ Commented Jul 25, 2018 at 7:50
  • $\begingroup$ If you read the whole response, you see that he gives a "continuous version" of cross-entropy which is pretty cool, but it turns out to just be the Mean Squared Error (MSE). $\endgroup$
    – JacKeown
    Commented Jul 26, 2018 at 13:44
  • $\begingroup$ The link tensorflow.org/versions/r0.9/api_docs/python/nn.html is broken again. $\endgroup$
    – Sycorax
    Commented Dec 31, 2023 at 18:57

6 Answers 6

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In general, it doesn't make sense to use TensorFlow functions like tf.nn.sigmoid_cross_entropy_with_logits for a regression task. In TensorFlow, “cross-entropy” is shorthand (or jargon) for “categorical cross entropy.”

The jargon "cross-entropy" is a little misleading, because there are any number of cross-entropy loss functions; however, it's a convention in machine learning to refer to this particular loss as "cross-entropy" loss.

If we look beyond the TensorFlow functions that you link to, then of course there are any number of possible cross-entropy functions. This is because the general concept of cross-entropy is about the comparison of two probability distributions. Depending on which two probability distributions you wish to compare, you may arrive at a different loss than the typical categorical cross-entropy loss. For example, the cross-entropy of a Gaussian target with some varying mean but fixed diagonal covariance reduces to mean-squared error. The general concept of cross-entropy is outlined in more detail in these questions:


The kind of "regression" suggested in the question supposes that we can replace the binary $y$ labels with any proportions. This section shows that this substitution is incorrect in general.

In TensorFlow, the cross-entropy loss function is the negative log-likelihood of the binomial distribution. For a single sample, the loss is given by $$ L = -y \log f(x) - (1-y) \log (1-f(x)) $$ where $y$ is the binary lable, $f$ is the model and $x$ is a single observation. If we $n$ observations with the same values $x$ for the features, but not all the same $y$ values, then the average loss for these $n$ samples is given by

$$ \frac{1}{n} \sum_i L_i =-\frac{1}{n} \sum_i \left[y_i \log f(x_i) + (1 - y_i) \log(1 - f(x_i)) \right] \\ = -\frac{k}{n} \log f(x) - \frac{n-k}{n} \log(1 - f(x)) \\ $$ where $k$ is the sum of $y$ for these $n$ samples. (We can collapse that sum because in this special case all the $x_i$ are identical.)

At this juncture, many people will leap to the conclusion that because the values $\frac{n-k}{n}$ and $\frac{k}{n}$ are probabilities (they're non-negative and they sum to 1 over disjoint events), then any time you have probabilities as $y$, it is appropriate to simply substitute the probabilities for the binary values $y$. This can bias the model. The demonstration is simple. Consider two distinct observations $x_1,x_2$ and their sums of binary labels $k_1=\sum_i y_1^{i},k_1=\sum_i y_2^{j}$ and sample counts $n_1,n_2$. Substituting the proportions is a blunder because this gives the loss as

$$\begin{align} \frac{1}{n_1}L_1 + \frac{1}{n_2}L_2 = &-\frac{k_1}{n_1} \log f(x_1) - \frac{n_1-k_1}{n_1} \log (1-f(x_1)) \\&- \frac{k_2}{n_2} \log f(x_2) - \frac{n_2-k_2}{n_2} \log (1-f(x_2)) \end{align}$$

It is a blunder because the proposed loss is not actually the average of all of the losses because the different sample sizes are neglected. This incorrect loss function yield produce a model that is biased in the sense that it weights all of the sample sizes equally, instead of giving more weight to the $x_i$ with larger $n_i$.

Correctly stated, the average loss is

$$\begin{align} \frac{1}{n_1+n_2} \sum_i L_i = &- \frac{k_1}{n_1+n_2} \log f(x_1) - \frac{n_1-k_1}{n_1+n_2} \log (1-f(x_1)) \\ &~- \frac{k_2}{n_1+n_2} \log f(x_2) - \frac{n_2-k_2}{n_1+n_2} \log (1-f(x_2)) \end{align}$$

The effect is to give more weight to the observations with larger sample sizes $n_i$. The blunder loss and the correct loss are only equivalent in the special case that all of the $n_i$ are equal; in this case, the blunder loss is a scalar multiple of the correct loss, which only changes the value of the loss function without changing the location of the minimum.

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    $\begingroup$ Although, it should be mentioned that using binary crossentropy as the loss function in a regression task where the output values are real values in the range [0,1] is a pretty reasonable and valid thing to do. $\endgroup$
    – today
    Commented Nov 21, 2018 at 8:45
  • $\begingroup$ @today Looking at it another way, consider that a beta distribution is a probability distribution on probabilities, so the support is $\mathbb{R} \cap [0,1]$. And we can easily write down a likelihood function. So, why would you use the sigmoid_cross_entropy_with_logits function as the loss instead of the negative log likelihood of a beta distribution? What are the criteria that you're using to decide that the binary cross entropy function is reasonable and valid? $\endgroup$
    – Sycorax
    Commented Sep 29 at 15:29
  • $\begingroup$ See also the discussion here stats.stackexchange.com/questions/639435/… Depending on how the target real values in $[0,1]$ are constructed, you could end up increasing the bias in your model. So I think your comment needs more qualification and description to explain when it's appropriate and when it's not. After all, the negative log likelihood of a probability distribution (e.g. beta distribution), is a cross-entropy loss (in the general sense, not the narrow sense of TensorFlow). $\endgroup$
    – Sycorax
    Commented Sep 29 at 15:33
  • $\begingroup$ @today I've expanded the answer to include a demonstration of how your proposed loss produces a biased model. $\endgroup$
    – Sycorax
    Commented Oct 2 at 12:34
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The answer given by @Sycorax is correct. However, it is worth mentioning that using (binary) cross-entropy in a regression task where the output values are in the range [0,1] is a valid and reasonable thing to do. Actually, it is used in image autoencoders (e.g. here and this paper). You might be interested to see a simple mathematical proof of why it works in this case in this answer.

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  • $\begingroup$ Loss functions can viewed as likelihoods / posteriors or some monotonic transformation of them. So, while it is true that in some regression models a loss similar to the cross-entropy might make sense, it might not be a reasonable approach to deal with any regression where the outputs are in a $[0, 1]$ range. $\endgroup$
    – adityar
    Commented Nov 21, 2018 at 14:36
  • $\begingroup$ @InfProbSciX "it might not be a reasonable approach to deal with any regression where the outputs are in a [0,1] range." So "reasonable" in what sense? Or how do you define the reasonability of loss function for a specific task? I suspect that statement might be true for any loss function. Is there any loss function that would be reasonable to use for all kinds of regression tasks, of course after defining the "reasonable"? $\endgroup$
    – today
    Commented Nov 21, 2018 at 14:41
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    $\begingroup$ The way I'd define reasonable is by constructing a model law. For example, in a regression framework such as $Y = f_{\theta}(X) + \epsilon$ where $\epsilon$ are i.i.d. errors - say normally distributed, the negative log-likelihood is exactly the squared loss. In a setting where the model law looks like $Y \sim Bernoulli(p_{\theta})$, the negative log-likelihood is exactly the binary cross entropy. Where the law is a linear regression with a normal prior on the coefs, the loss corresponds to the L2 penalty and so on. Where possible, I'd construct a law and then derive a loss. $\endgroup$
    – adityar
    Commented Nov 21, 2018 at 14:46
  • $\begingroup$ @InfProbSciX Thanks for your reply. So as you mentioned, depending on the regression task (and the assumptions on the distribution of data, errors, etc.) a loss function might not be reasonable to be used. And, as I mentioned, this is true for all loss functions, including crossentropy. Of course, I see your point that just because the output values are in the range [0,1] does not guarantee that crossentropy is the optimal choice loss function and I was not trying to convey the otherwise in my answer. $\endgroup$
    – today
    Commented Nov 21, 2018 at 15:14
  • $\begingroup$ This need not be restricted to output range of [0,1] only. Users of deep models prefer cross entropy over MSE. I have seen non [0,1] regression output being compressed to [0,1] using a sigmoid just to use cross entropy loss function after that. Of course later on we need to apply a logit function later on the predicted values to get back the original range. Dropout, BatchNorm etc are more stable with Cross Entropy loss and in general the convergence is also faster $\endgroup$
    – Allohvk
    Commented Aug 16, 2021 at 5:50
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Deep learning frameworks often mix models and losses and refer to the cross-entropy of a multinomial model with softmax nonlinearity by cross_entropy, which is misleading. In general, you can define cross-entropy for arbitrary models.

For a Gaussian model with varying mean but fixed diagonal covariance, it is equivalent to MSE. For a general covariance, cross-entropy would correspond to a squared Mahalanobis distance. For an exponential distribution, the cross-entropy loss would look like $$f_\theta(x) y - \log f_\theta(x),$$ where $y$ is continuous but non-negative. So yes, cross-entropy can be used for regression.

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Unfortunately, the as of now accepted answer by @Sycorax, while detailed, is incorrect.

Actually, a prime example of regression through categorical cross-entropy -- Wavenet -- has been implemented in TensorFlow.

The principle is that you discretize your output space and then your model only predicts the respective bin; see Section 2.2 of the paper for an example in the sound modelling domain. So while technically the model performs classification, the eventual task solved is regression.

An obvious downside is, that you lose output resolution. However, this may not be a problem (at least I think that the Google's artificial assistant spoke a very humanly voice) or you can play around with some post-processing, e.g. interpolating between the most probable bin and it's two neighbours.

On the other hand, this approach makes the model much more powerful compared to the usual single-linear-unit output, i.e. allowing to express multi-modal predictions or to assess it's confidence. Note though that the latter can be naturally achieved by other means, e.g. by having an explicit (log)variance output as in Variational Autoencoders.

Anyway, this approach does not scale well to more-dimensional output, because then the size of the output layer grows exponentially, making it both computational and modelling issue..

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    $\begingroup$ I see what you're saying, but I wouldn't personally consider discretizing your output space as performing "regression" as much as it is approximating a regression problem using classification...but I guess it's just a matter of terminology/convention. $\endgroup$
    – JacKeown
    Commented Nov 27, 2018 at 19:09
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    $\begingroup$ Agreed. The 32-bit float space is discrete anyway :-) $\endgroup$
    – dedObed
    Commented Nov 27, 2018 at 20:46
  • $\begingroup$ I'm struggling to determine any part of this answer that supports the claim that my answer is "incorrect." You wrote "The principle is that you discretize your output space and then your model only predicts the respective bin" -- this is an operation on categories. It's a perfect example of what my answer describes as "categorical cross-entropy." $\endgroup$
    – Sycorax
    Commented Jan 3 at 15:17
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I've revisited this question as I now disagree with the answer I previously accepted. Cross entropy loss CAN be used in regression (although it isn't common.)

It comes down to the fact that cross-entropy is a concept that only makes sense when comparing two probability distributions. You could consider a neural network which outputs a mean and standard deviation for a normal distribution as its prediction. It would then be punished more harshly for being more confident about bad predictions. So yes, it makes sense, but only if you're outputting a distribution in some sense. The link from @SiddharthShakya in a comment to my original question shows this.

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    $\begingroup$ This answer seems to answer the question in a different way than it's asked. The functions that you linked to in the question are about a specific kind of cross-entropy loss, and your question seems to ask if those functions can be used in regression, and my answer is written as if you are asking how to use those functions you link to. The answer here seems to answer the question "Can cross-entropy be generalized beyond classification?" Editing the Q would make it clear that the focus is on how mathematical concepts are defined, rather than focusing on how to use Tensorflow functions. $\endgroup$
    – Sycorax
    Commented Jan 19, 2020 at 23:11
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    $\begingroup$ I understand your objection, but I plan on leaving the question as is because it represents my original query which I feel could help people with the same question I had. At any rate, the entire post should contain enough information overall. $\endgroup$
    – JacKeown
    Commented Jan 21, 2020 at 0:26
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Yes, sure.

What is Cross-Entropy?

Let's think about what is Cross-Entropy (CE). CE cost in the context of PyTorch or another Frameworks can mean a different thing compare to MATH. Originally cross-entropy is some form of KL-divergence between distributions: https://sites.google.com/site/burlachenkok/articles/properties-of-kl-divergence

Reasons:

  1. In the context of Machine Learning, the very often first argument for CE is typically vector from probability simplex such that it has one component equal to one. So input for CE is probability mass function (p.m.f.) in a discrete case.

  2. Inside PyTorch let's say there is an extra transformation called in STATS as "symmetric logistics transform" which $$\dfrac{exp(f_i(x)}{exp(f_1(x))+exp(f_2(x))+\dots + exp(f_k(x))}$$ What it's interesting it's a bijective mapping from Euclidane space into probabilistic simplex.

Now, what is a regression?

Regression in the context of probability theory means $E_{z}[y(x,z)|x]$ where by z I denote unobserved variables. In the context of machine learning, it means any predictor with an output single scalar variable or multiple scalar variables and it is not necessary conditional expectation.


So as you see - there is already too much confusion with various terminology and basic terms in STATS and ML.

If your model provides K scalar outputs (called sometimes logits) it can be plugged into CE with the symmetric logistic transformation. For the record - logits are just unbound scores from $\mathbb{R}$ such that class with maximum score is your prediction.


I think the answer you can do whatever you want, and people do crazy things with Loss in STATS, Optimization, and Deep Learning Applications.

I can not give you an exact answer because CE very often raised with classification models e.g. in Deep Learning or with Decision Trees. But if your question because you design such a system - it's better to allow more expressive power in Loss construction.

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